He sustained multiple injuries including a fractured skull and a pneumo/haemothorax. This was the first stunt in Jackass Number Two after the opening sequence. For those who do not already know, a roof rake is like a snow shovel, but with a really long handle. The original poster, I do feel sorry that you had a tough day out. Last summer we decided to take our three daughters, age 10,12 and 14, up The Langdales. In thick weather Jack's Rake is extremely hazardous and should not be attempted." Also, for those of you who say, oh it's a classic grade 1 straight forward scramble, just think back to your first time on it and whether you were led up there or picked your own route, because that changes things a lot. Sent my nine year old boy up a couple of moves ahead of me and he breezed it. Just take note … It is certainly no place for inexperienced adults to take children, or perhaps even to go without them. Days after Donald Trump’s account was banned, Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey explained that it was the right decision, but still sets a dangerous precedent. Pavey Ark is a popular climbing crag, so awareness of other people is hugely important. x.type = 'password'; Pavey Ark and Harrison Stickle dominate the shore of the tarn. Yes, they were in a bit of danger, at 800M cloud can descend fast, and if you dwell on that point and that point alone, then you could consider them a bit daft. This was in 1973 on a showery day. A. I would definitely say Jack's Rake is not a place for children or inexperienced scramblers and not for anybody without a head for heights. I always thought that it was better than most because if you did stay in the groove, your fall is limited. Photo Gallery    Amazing views . very dangerous. Review tags are currently only available for English language reviews. I was at the bottom of the of the three and was convinced that he was going to fall and and knock me off the ledge. There have been quite a few deaths recently on Jacks Rake of inexperienced walkers. I must be honest and explain that I had two moments when I froze completely. Routes like this are for experienced individuals with knowledge of the fells, not tourists with ideas above their stations. How many people died that day driving to work? A. Only to someone puffed up with their own sense of self importance. Camping    A five yr old! Both thoroughly enjoyed it although my wife (watching from stickle tarn) wasn't so keen. Now THAT is stupid and irresponsible but taking a 12 year old on a scramble or climb that is reasonably within their ability is not IMHO stupid or mad! I climbed the rake with my 11yo (a scrambler and a beginner rock climber), A unique experience - arguably Lakeland's most accessible rock climb. A. I think the problem is peoples understanding of 'Scrambling'. It depends on the children, and on the adults. Taking a 10 year old up Jacks Rake is bloody wreckless. Waited for a couple of dry days, did Helvellyn by the Edges and Sharp Edge as a warm-up and then set off. In these conditions the route was a completely different animal to the one tackled on previous occasions. I knew that the climb was going to be challenging but I had no idea quite how challenging it was. What I want to know is, who decides on the gradings, and can I sue the magazine for the emotional distress of putting my three daughters' lives in peril? Surely the answer depends on the child, I know kids who are FAR superior climbers to many adults; if anything their adult guide is more of a liability than they are. How this can be classified as a Level 1 scramble, I'll never know. A simple wiki search will give you the definition. Wainwright explains this in exquisite detail, Bob Allan also worth reading. in my opinion Jacks rake is a route that needs to be taken very seriously, having completed the route several times in different weather conditions. Care is needed on some sections and... A very good scramble that is easily accessible. Crib Goch. Where a tricky section is encountered - such as Jack's Rake, Striding Edge or Sharp Edge - reference is made to this on the walk guide itself so you can decide for yourself whether this is for you or not. Nice and easy and always enjoyable. A. Have fun! A lake district classic, with sustained scrambling all the way to the top, located in the fantastic Landgdale valley. Walks    A WOMAN died after falling from a popular scrambling route in the Lake District. Find New Walking Friends    Thrilling scramble and has left me hungry for more! The earlier you take care of your roof, the smaller the risk of water damage to your home. It's up to the individual to determine what's do-able and what isn't, based on their experience, ability, nerve and - very importantly - the conditions at the time. This is technically not a hard scramble, but i would consider it to be throwing someone inexperienced in this area at the deep (or high) end. Although the exposure isn’t too extreme for most of the scramble, the rake is a very dangerous place to be in high winds. Halls fell is also a grade 1 I believe and I found that to be damn right dangerous due to the slightly damp greasy shale (the kids are more lightweight than their portly father and had no such issue). Of course that respect for the dangers is healthy and you have to be careful children don't get too cocky... A. I have done Jacks Rake 3 times, each time in similar dry and good conditions. All our walks follow established footpaths unless otherwise stated within the route text. A. Hi. Everybody is entitled to that feeling, children adults and the elderly. I generally have a massive amount of respect for you and your work, I know that many of you come from a solid background and have experience of the various mountain ranges around the world that make the British hills look puny. The 10 most recent questions about Mountains and Hills . Jacks Rake isn't particularly dangerous in this respect, though. It's thought that Eugenie and Jack may also decide to wait a while before releasing their little one's name to the public. Whether you use this document as a reference when things get difficult or as a road map to get you from beginning to end, we're pretty sure you'll find what you're looking for here. Care is needed on some sections and... However if you are experienced, and have the knowledge and equipment to safeguard them, and if the children are adventurous and active then it would make a wonderful expedition. I made it about one third up, but was defeated by the conditions; a veritable stream running down the gulley, the very steep climbing up slippery and slimey rocks, getting very wet and the sheer terror! I have to say that it is a typical Grade 1 scramble. }. We did Go Ape in the morning and then we climbed Pavey Ark [Langdale Pikes] in the afternoon. A small boy has difficulty keeping his seat on rough ground and this work is more or less dangerous. Fig rolls would taste horrid if you had to first eat through a wrapping of cotton wool. Jack"s Rake: Gets the adrenaline up! Rant over - Anyone want a used soapbox!? Peaks and Mountains    A. A. I think the hint is in the word "scramble" NOT a "walk" or "hike" It was my first grade 1 scramble and I was on my own. Log On/Accounts    Seasonal variations: Jack's Rake becomes a grade I winter climbing in full winter conditions and can be dangerous under a coating of verglas. As for saying it's not for children - that's stupid. He's even done a couple of V.diffs with pre-placed runners. Your Stories    Talk to us    Recently a five yr old from Crib Goch for eg. Photo, Print, Drawing Eight-year old Jack driving horse rake. We where well equipped & experienced but every day is different on the fells & this is one route where weather conditions can make a huge difference. It's looks more difficult/dangerous from a distance trust me! It took all my concentration and about half an hour to get back down, which was no mean feat. As one guy says his children ascended safely on a rope and I saw two very young girls once obviously with a sensible and experience father taking them up calmly on a rope. Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey cited his passion for… Out of seven of us on the trip three of us decided to walk up Pavey Ark via Jack's Rake (me being one) and the other four walked the [relatively] safer way to the top [Walk route map c281 The Langdale Pikes via North Rake from The New Dungeon Ghyll, Great Langdale]. They kept a keen eye open for any cloud and would have immediately back off down the (very clear) tourist path at the first sign of it. It is essential to bear in mind that scrambling is not hard hill walking, it's easy rock climbing, and more dangerous because it's usually done unroped. A. Photo, Print, Drawing Eight-year old Jack driving horse rake. No Bob i share your sentiments, but how you police it would be a nightmare. There are many kids I would take into the mountains and happily guide them up a Grade 1 with hardly a second thought. I've sat in pubs listening to "experts" talking total codsh*t, each tale inflating their ego more than the last. Its not as though you arent aware as you approach Jacks Rake from Stickle Barn that it may be dangerous, its a huge precipice that says i may be a bit tricky. A dangerous spirit has returned from the past! Even MRT can fall foul of this kind of arrogance; I've been called an "idiot" a few times by bigots (a few times perhaps justifiably, I grant). See Hine Report, Rural Child Labor, August, 1915. It is for the most part sheltered from the sheer drop of the mountainside with breathtaking views. The majority of the scramble was OK for my average ability, but the worst point was just past the open section. Location: Western Massachusetts, Massachusetts. Places to Stay    Achievable for most but not for the faint hearted. Both my children climbed Jack Rake when they were 8 and 10. var x = document.getElementById('password'); See Grades for more details. ).The views on the way up can be vertigo inducing and don't be surprised to see roped up climbers crossing paths with you on their way up the vertical slab. Well defined and pitched paths throughout. I was taken up far more exposed and demanding routes by I was 8 but then I was quite used to it and my dad knew what he was doing. We passed climbers who were down climbing... so it is wide enough! Laughing Jack Fact #1 ... causing a deformed dangerous human like being. I had researched the route thoroughly and have been 'walking' to the top of mountains for twenty years so felt that I had the skills to get to the top. I have only been up once. But all in all, it is an amazing experience. Was very nervous because, yes there are some bits where if you slip, you are in for a very long fall indeed! and Halls Fell Ridge is a bit less severe in my opinion. It could be a demon whom haunts its victims and lives in forest, caves, dwelling within the dark shadows. Do not take children up these places unless sufficient experience and knowledge has been attained. You can read about my ascent of Jack's Rake in my Lake District Walksblog. The 1st 70m are the hardest though there are plenty of handholds. My bet is that I have likely been through worse conditions than most from big winds on big climbs to total whiteouts on ridges and I can only think of two occasions where I felt anything close to being out of my depth. I went with someone who had... The adults tend to be more scared. OK, they said it would be a difficult start. I won't be doing the Rake again, the alternate route to the left of Pavey Ark is very pleasant anyway. There are a few places that would be iffy and almost dangerous in the wet (most of the scramble is greasy from water run off anyway). Jack’s Rake becomes a natural drainage line in wet weather and is often full of running water, so it’s best avoided in heavy rain. Peak Bagging    But please can we get a sense of perspective of risk, can we also remember that the hills are for all and that hillwalking / scrambling, climbing, mountaineering, etc are actually relatively safe activities with relatively few fatalities when compared to many other sports and activities? This is where a large left-footed step is necessary - I am 5 foot 9 inches and found it hard (also I am extremely right-footed and my natural move is to my right side), so a child or small person with short steps would have problems. It crosses a massive cliff, for heaven's sake! There really needs to be some kind of warning with magazine articles, which all too often assume a certain level of experience. People need to understand what scrambling is, the grading is on the technical difficulties, a grade one scramble can still have huge exposure and a fall will be fatal e.g. They are both well kitted out and I feel both are more than capable of doing relativley easy scrambles such as Jakes Rake [Jack's Rake]. Thing is a scramble like Jack's Rake is mountaineering and there IS danger of serious injury/death. But they'd driven up from London and, statistically had a massively higher risk of dying on the drive there / home than anything that mountain threw at them that day. I shall definitely attempt it again. We, as adults are in danger of bringing up a generation of children who, once they break away from the apron strings, won't recognise a dangerous situation until it's too late. However, this 'beginners' route had places where our girls could not get up without help as anyone under 5ft tall could not reach the footholds; places where a slip could send one plunging vertically down a cliff face (we quite literally crossed the path of some rope climbers half way up) and the scramble could not be back-climbed, being popular and far too narrow for passing. Yes and no. Can I suggest u either a, follow routes from country walking or b, use a guide to gain experience on this type of route to gain the relevant experience it is fun rather than frightening with the correct training. Would I have gone up if water was running down to meet me? A. I climbed it for the third time last week. For a first scramble striding seems exhilarating, after doing Jacks we revisited helvellyn at easter and found striding/swirral to be easy. The difficulty is not in the actual scramble but in the almost inability to backtrack once you start - there are nearly ALWAYS people following you. There's a lot of arrogance in some of these replies. We made it to the top but I bricked myself! They managed every part of the scramble without help and had a great day, however I would be unwilling to take children or adults without their ability and experience. Good parking available (including NT car park at StickleBarn). Competitions    Click here for the A - Z, Questions & Answers about Walking & Hiking, Jack's Rake and Pavey Ark from Harrison Stickle, half-way up Jack's Rake with Stickle Tarn below, Walk route map c281 The Langdale Pikes via North Rake from The New Dungeon Ghyll, Great Langdale. An easy walk following stickle ghyll leads you to stickle tarn. I can only look back and think I took quite a few alternative routes up it on the second attempt - there are some accounts in the first 10-15 google hits of Jack's Rake of experiences of slip and die moments (in dry conditions), and a reference in one of the biggest youtube hits, guy in jeans, - but most people who's been up before scoff at this idea. That risk is present for the experienced and non experienced and can only be managed / reduced but never removed. function myFunction() { As parents you protect your children from harm. Years later, hiding incognito far from London-a teacher at Miss Emery's Establishment for the Education of Genteel Ladies-Miranda has made a respectable life for herself, away from the ton and the dangerous men who inhabit it. I suspect it is possible to learn how to cope with this fear with practise. 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